In celebration of the 10th anniversary of NCTM's landmark publication, Principles to Actions: Ensuring Mathematical Success for All, hosts Kevin Dykema and Latrenda Knighten examine its impact with lead authors Steve Leinwand, Deann Huinker, and Dan Brahier.
In celebration of the 10th anniversary of NCTM's landmark publication, Principles to Actions: Ensuring Mathematical Success for All, hosts Kevin Dykema and Latrenda Knighten examine its impact with lead authors Steve Leinwand, Deann Huinker, and Dan Brahier.
NCTM - Podcast Series (April 18, 2024)
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
mathematics, practices, principles, teaching, classroom, education, actions, chapters, document, teachers, dan, beliefs, list, principals, assessments, effective, curriculum, steve, math, unproductive
SPEAKERS
Kevin Dykema, Steve Leinwand, Latrenda Knighten, Deann Huinker, Dan Brahier
Kevin Dykema 00:00
Hello, and welcome to the first episode of the new National Council of Teachers of Mathematics podcast, adding it all up. My name is Kevin Dykema. And I have the privilege of being the current NCTM. President.
Latrenda Knighten 00:13
Hi, my name is Latrenda Knighten and the NCTM president elect. Each month Kevin and I will serve as your co host, where we will connect with key members of the mathematics community to discuss current topics, insights and emerging trends,
Kevin Dykema 00:32
Latrenda and I will kick off each episode of adding it all up with what we're going to call a chat with the presidents. It's a short discussion of what's currently on our minds as it relates to all our guests, and the latest happenings in mathematics education. The
Latrenda Knighten 00:50
first episode of adding it all happens to coincide with the 10th anniversary of NCTM landmark publication principles to actions, principles or actions has been influential at connecting research based teaching practices, essential to high quality mathematics education, with core principles to build a successful Mathematics Program at all levels. Kevin, how have you seen success with this landmark publication?
Kevin Dykema 01:24
So there's two things that come to mind when I think about principles to action and ants and the success of it. The first thing, it's 10 years old now. And mathematics education as a whole agrees these are the eight effective teaching practices when we look at that slice of principles to actions. And we know how rarely, anybody agrees in education for more than three or four years. And this is 10 years that we're agreeing these are the eight effective teaching practices. The second thing that excites me, when I think about the student experiences when teachers are utilizing these eight effective mathematics teaching practices, how much richer how much deeper, how much more engaging are the student experiences, than we have been what many of us may have had as students will try it? I know you've got a personal story with the with the principals to actions as we prepared for this earlier, you want to share that story? Sure,
Latrenda Knighten 02:16
I would love to share that story. In 2014, when principals to actions was first introduced Tara mathematics community, actually, that fall left my classroom to a role where supported teachers in my school district. And it was very refreshing to have this resource, really as my playbook to use to support the teachers and the principals and the coaches in my school district. By having those eight effective teaching practices as our guide to help us to prepare for high quality mathematics instruction. In my school district. Things
Kevin Dykema 02:57
flipped around. And I'm just really looking forward to these next series of podcasts co hosting them with you and hearing from so many mathematics education leaders. So let's get right to it. And let's dive in and have a conversation with our first series of guests. Today. Latrina and I are so excited and so honored to be joined by the lead writers of principles to action. So please join me in welcoming Steve Leinwand, Dan Breyer and Dan hanker. Do you have if you can just tell us who you are. And then we'll turn it over to Dan, and then we'll turn it over to Steve.
Deann Huinker 03:26
Sure. Hi, Kevin. Hi, Latrenda. We're happy to be here. I'm Deann Huinker, and I am a professor at the University of Wisconsin Milwaukee.
Dan Brahier 03:34
And I am Dan Brahier, I'm a professor of math education at Bowling Green State University in Ohio. And
Steve Leinwand 03:40
I'm Steve Linewand. And I am a semi retired principal researcher at the American Institutes for Research and self proclaimed mathematics education change agents.
Kevin Dykema 03:52
Thanks to the three of you. We're so excited to have you here with us today. So I'm going to ask the first question in DN. I'll ask you to respond first. But then Dan and Steve, feel free to jump in when when you add. So Dan, as we think about the 10th anniversary of his landmark book principles to actions, how would you say that the book has influenced the mathematics field? Are there any specific examples that you find that are particularly rewarding principle
Deann Huinker 04:19
to action has influenced the field in so many ways? I mean, you can't go to a conference hardly or read an article without someone referencing principles to action and talking about it. You know, so as I think about the biggest influence, I think it's really refocused us in math, education and what matters most. And that's what goes on in schools, as teachers and students interactive classrooms, and how administrators and other individuals support and work together to improve those quality to work towards high quality math programs. So as I think about principles of action, as I talk with people, they keep saying, it's my go to resource, this is what I go to When I need to have a conversation or think about what do we mean by high quality mathematics instruction? So it really has launched this national conversation about what we value and need to be working towards in mathematics. Oh, let my colleagues jump in.
Dan Brahier 05:17
Yeah, in my mind, it took the discussion to another level, in 2000, NCTM released principles and standards for school mathematics, which was a landmark document at the time. And there were principles and standards. And so I think what everybody focused on at the time were the standards, what should we be doing curriculum wise across the grade levels. But what seemed to get lost in the discussion was the principles themselves. And so we kind of reconvened this process. And here we are 14 years later, we're talking about those principles that more or less got lost in 2000, because curriculum overshadowed them. And we were able to really dig deeply into what the meaning of those principles was, as well as to be able to update with the latest research, and so forth, so that we could put out there not only what we should be teaching, but let's talk more effectively about how we teach those topics.
Steve Leinwand 06:18
And I think building on what Dan just said, how has it influenced the field, I think in some fundamental ways, it has reminded us that NCTM is alive and well. And it's an important resource, an important place to turn, I joined NCTM in 1974, I It's hard to believe that I've been a member for 50 years, I remember when the NCTM standards just changed everything they NCTM standards is what we what we talked about, and NCTM has, like all organizations, you know, sort of risen and fallen and risen and fallen and principles to actions has really told the field that NCTM has a great deal to offer. Thank
Latrenda Knighten 07:00
you for those responses. Dan, could you tell us more about how the book came together, the origins of the eight effective teaching practices that are discussed in the book, and its journey to becoming a pivotal work? And that Maddox education? Sure.
Deann Huinker 07:18
Now, as I reflect back on when we started this work as a writing team, we really were like, what does the profession need? What do we need as a mathematics education community. And I remember an article I read by Deborah Ball, where she really challenged the field, to identify a set of teaching practices that really had ambitious outcomes for student learning, and something that we could come together around for mathematics. So I think in principals action, we really took up that challenge, we're like, wait a minute, what makes a difference in classrooms? What is most effective to get us where we need to be to get to that deep learning within our students that's going to last them a lifetime. So we said, let's do it. Let's come up with a list of effective teaching practices. So we looked at 25 plus years of research, and try to discern what do we know works? What makes a difference? And we had lots of discussion, lots of debate, lots of lists. And we really identified and came to consensus on that there were these this set of eight effective teaching practices that have really been proven over the test of time as what we need in classrooms to get us to those ambitious outcomes for student learning.
Steve Leinwand 08:37
Yeah, I think it's really neat. If there's a document on this computer that I'm on right now, that is called principles to actions, teaching practices, and there are 20 or 22, different lists, different iterations. It's really wonderful proof about if you are going to get quality. If you're going to get something that has lasting and staying power, it takes time and it takes iteration and it takes careful review. We have these things as low as six standard six practices at one point. They were as high as 20. I remember when it was nine, and we said can we squeeze it to 10? I remember when it was 13. And we said well, that's going to be problematic. We make it it doesn't. But but we worried about bite size, we worried about overlap. And frankly 10 years later, I am blown away that with all the griping and all of the sniping. No one has come out publicly and said NCTM you got it wrong. They're the wrong eight. You missed one. There's double talk to it. I mean, and so it's incredibly gratifying that the process really worked in in ways that gave us these particular 8am they have they have withstood the test of time.
Deann Huinker 09:53
I'll add on. I was just gonna say to I was I think about the eight effective teaching practice. They really given us professional language, to talk about what matters the most in classrooms, and that language now I hear people talk about productive struggle all the time. And that came out on our list, I have people say, I'm working on my questioning, I really want them to be purposeful, or, oh, wait a minute, we're not emphasizing enough connections among these different representations. I hear people using this language all the time now, as I talk with teachers, math coaches, curriculum specialist, so it's given us professional language to talk about our field, which means we can focus on it and improve it.
Dan Brahier 10:36
When Steve refers to the longevity of the document. I believe one of the things that contributed significantly to that was not only do we have a number of great thinkers around the table, to write the document, but we also floated a draft document out. And you know, it went out there. And we got lots of feedback, hundreds of people that responded to it. Probably more than that, as I recall, but I remember people looking at the original draft and say, Hey, have you thought about this? Or you didn't mention that? And in some cases, we look at it and said, Yeah, we did think about that. But we didn't actually write about it, maybe we need to add that. So when you get that much feedback from people in the field, you continue to tweak it and make it the type of document that has a long term effect on the profession.
Kevin Dykema 11:21
Thanks for sharing that history of how principles to action came together and all the feedback had that you received. So Damn, how do you think these eight effective teaching practices have contributed to the enhancement of mathematics teaching and learning in classrooms?
Dan Brahier 11:37
I think about that old adage that says, if you don't know where you're going, I can guarantee you you'll never get there. When we started thinking about these eight teaching practices, we started reflecting on what are the things that teachers really should be doing in their classroom on a regular basis. And, as Dan said, it was a year's worth of research that we were able to look at, and refined down to that that kind of final list, that book, the longest chapter is on teaching and learning, because that's the heart of what we do as math teachers. So we really wanted to get that right to make sure that those each of those practices was described thoroughly enough that teachers would know exactly what we're talking about. What I found, as a strength of the chapter and of the whole of the eight practices is that they seem to be useful on all levels. So methods instructors, who teach people how to teach math across the country have been able to use those eight practices as a basis for instruction. So they can talk about what does it mean to teach mathematics effectively? And what are those practices and so it's used in the in the pre service domain, but also they're effective for the classroom teacher, if I'm trying to look at how to improve my practice, how I go about writing lessons, what I'm doing in my classroom every day, that can be the lens through which I'm looking at my planning and teaching. And then lastly, and maybe most importantly, of what I've seen in in, in the field, is that administrators have picked up on those eight teaching practices, there was a time before principles to actions where administrators would go into into classrooms and say, you know, I'm not a math person, but I'm observing a math teacher, that's not my background, I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be looking for. And now this gives them a lens to look for, as you're observing a class, are the teachers doing these eight things in the classroom, and as a way of being able to evaluate not only from the outside, but also for a teacher to evaluate their own teaching in the classroom as in that lens.
Latrenda Knighten 13:40
Okay, thank you. Each principle addresses specific aspects of mathematics education, from teaching and learning to access and equity. Can you discuss how these principles intersect and contribute to the creation of effective mathematics programs? Sure,
Dan Brahier 13:59
I think that writing individual chapters about each one of those principles, teaching and learning, assessment, technology, and so forth, is kind of like trying to write a geometry book without mentioning algebra, or to write a statistics book without writing, you know, mentioning number. So in a sense, the each of the chapters depends on the other. So they're not intended to be pillars standing up by themselves. And yet, we've got to have topics that we can look at. And so there's no question that each one of the chapters and the details in them affect what is going on in the others. But what the we wanted to give the reader an opportunity to look at a specific thing so that what if we are dealing with curriculum issues? What does this document say about how we can improve our curriculum, thoughts about that, etc. I think the strongest thing that is featured in each one of the chapters that makes them parallel is this list. What we call productive and unproductive beliefs. And I recall, as we were sitting around the table, writing the document thinking to ourselves, you know, there are some things that we know that these kinds of beliefs lead to dead ends. And these kinds of beliefs about our practice are going to improve things, can we actually spell those out in a table at the end of each chapter. And so we've got things in there. Like in the technology chapter, it talks about how it's an unproductive belief to say, I need to teach my students everything with pencil and paper first, and they can use technology later. We know that's not true research doesn't support that students learn by using the technology that will help them to be able to do the things with pencil and paper, they have to go hand in hand. And so one exercise I've done with teachers in workshops is to take those beliefs and put them on little pieces of paper on the table, and let them sort them what is productive, and what's unproductive to actually think about what they believe about mathematics education. So the chapters do have coherence among one another, but also address each of these different principles, these different areas of math education,
Deann Huinker 16:07
I'm just going to affirm what Dan was just saying, I mean, I have done the same thing. We take those lists of productive and unproductive beliefs. We sort them, we discuss them. And I think what is embedded in this document is that we need to start there. What are our beliefs about what is effective math, teaching and learning? What are the components of a high quality curriculum. So I just think one of the one of the great contributions of this book is really putting those beliefs on the table, so that we can have these really serious and challenging conversations,
Steve Leinwand 16:40
I would only add and tie this up into a nice, a nice package with a with a bow. Every time we step back from the very first meeting of the entire writing team, and asked the question, what are the problems? What are we trying to address on that list was beliefs and mindsets over and over again? How do we address the fact that people have beliefs or mindsets that are counter the research that hurt kids? And so in so many ways, the beliefs that the productive and unproductive beliefs tables really helped to surface this idea of what are your beliefs? What are your mindsets and helping people confront the fact that their beliefs actually are aligned with things that we're suggesting, are unproductive and I think that's been very powerful and very important. And it's another case where as we know, NCTM is very positive, very upbeat, the idea of unproductive the idea of don't do certain things, is just not part of what NCTM has done. I think that putting this in there, and having the blunt statements about unproductive released beliefs about curriculum about instruction, about technology, about professionalism, had been really powerful parts of using this document for change. So
Kevin Dykema 18:05
as lead writers, I mean, there's so many different messages in there, and so many wonderful things for us. Can you sort of sum up? What is one of the key messages that you're hoping that that readers educators take away from reading the book? And how do you see you know, that key message really impacting the shape and mathematics teaching practices in the years to come?
Steve Leinwand 18:25
I'll take this one. I think that the first key message is that it's an interconnected system. When Dan talks about the different chapters, it's not just chapters, but it is large contributing factors in your quality mathematics education program, I was lucky enough to be part of a group that wrote the paper back in 2004, about what the United States can learn from Singapore, and was Singapore can learn in the United States. And what we learned is that in Singapore, it's not just that each of the components of the system are high quality and strong, but they are carefully aligned with each other, certainly compared with the fact that we have a curriculum which is different than our structural practices, which is different than our assessments which aren't aligned with our professional development. And then we wonder why we have a fragmented system. You know, my background also, you know, when I was in the Connecticut Department of Education, we had one of the, the NSF State Systemic initiative grants and that gave me a chance to worry a great deal about this notion of system. I think when we stop and say, okay, it is about the frontline. It is about what happens in the classroom. It is about the pedagogical quality, but as important as that is, it exists within a system where it is supported by a powerful set of curriculum materials where it is aligned and supported with and assessment and just that is still a reminder of how far we have to come. I mean, we don't have instructional materials that support the eight mathematical teaching practices as well as we'd like. And we certainly know that we still have multiple choice drivel for assessments that don't serve what we really need. The idea of technology and an edit professionalism as critical to this is the message that I think we still need to broadcast regularly. And that this opportunity to step back from a 10th edition, and a 10th anniversary, and my God, not a 10th edition, step back from a 10th anniversary and realize that it's not just that there's work to do, but that that work is one of the components that support this first chapter, this instructional improvement. And, and the book attempts to do that. I think that the other message that's so important, is that step back, as bad as things are in places as good as things are in places, as well as the scores are going up a little bit, as well as the pandemic issues that we faced, we step back and NCTM says in principles to actions, world, we have a majority of the answers for how to do a whole lot better. We know that we can change curriculum in these ways we can embed the technology, we can build collaboration, and professionalism and treat teachers as if they are professionals, and recognize that professional development has got to be both professional and develop things in order to in order to make this work. And the ways in which the mindset that we have the answers, it's a matter of will a matter of resources in some cases of leadership. And that's really the takeaway that we are still working with and why I think this document will be around for a while. To
Dan Brahier 22:01
add to that, I want to emphasize I think what Steve said about it being a system of different factors, as he said, not individual, just chapters, I think that that when we look at the the field of mathematics, mathematics, education, we got to recognize that there are many different components that are have to act together. And that if we do something different in our teaching and learning that its impact, it's going to have an impact on the curriculum, it's going to have an impact on our assessment. If we do something different, and we improve and the way that we're using technology, then we're going to have to rethink the way that we're doing our assessments. All of these pieces are interconnected, but they're all important components to look at. You can't fix one of them without fixing the whole set, everything impacts one another. And so it's really intended to be a package that tells us here are all the pieces that you ought to be thinking about to to change your improve your math education program, and recognizing that they all fit together, they work together as a group.
Latrenda Knighten 23:01
Thank you for those powerful words from the panel. I have one last question. How do you see principals actions, continuing to provide actionable guidance to educators and stakeholders in the field of mathematics education, particularly in the context of advancing access, equity, and excellence for all statements?
Steve Leinwand 23:29
We're trying to what a great question and what an important question. Um, so I was reading street data, I had heard that St. Data was being used as a book study in lots of school districts and people will in the State Department's of education, were talking about it. So I obviously downloaded it from from Amazon and and started reading it on my Kindle. I have read the first four chapters, I have not gone beyond the first page of Chapter Five, because there is a line on the first page of Chapter Five of street data that says, equity is first and foremost, pedagogical. And it absolutely stopped me in my tracks. You know, we we took a big hit in some quarters that we put pedagogy ahead of access and equity. We said that access and equity is a supporter of pedagogy. And this turned around this notion of connecting them, I think, is what without even realizing it explicitly, principles to actions did. When we take catalyzing change and see the way in which NCTM has expanded the eight mathematical teaching practices into equitable teaching practices, it just warms my heart. It says that when we say oh, we got to be more equitable, we got to give Coach more access. It all happens in the classroom. It Well yes, there's tracking and those policies and all but the essence is what happens in the classroom when teachers are regularly adapting using wrestling with the eight mathematical teaching practices, they are engaging kids, they're asking questions or encouraging discourse. They're using tasks that are rich and engaging. All of a sudden, we raise the access of kids and provide more equitable education. And so that kind of guidance is, to me an absolutely critical piece. I think that the other, the other real outcome or guidance piece, is the idea of a mirror. I don't want a checklist of are you doing this or you're not doing that? I want a picture, I want a story of what high quality mathematics programs ought to look like. I want people to say, Yeah, we do this, yeah, we do this, oh, my God, we don't do that, oh, we're not doing this. I'm holding up as a mirror and reflecting on the existence of mathematics in your school, in your district in your state, and stopping and saying, you know, we really don't do a very good job with our professional development than our professionalism. Or, you know, it's time for us to change our assessments because they are not supporting things. I also think that the message is there, the change improvement is not simple. I have spent a lot of time since the pandemic, wrestling with the fact that every moment of our lives, we are confronted with the fact that our society is more complex by the day, that it is nuanced in amazingly complicated and intriguing ways, and that there is great ambiguity. And unfortunately, we live in a time where people want simple answers, simple answers that are often useless and wrong. schools that teach kids to simply regurgitate schools that don't ask kids to think, or not preparing kids for this world of complexity and ambiguity, and, and nuance. And I think that to the degree that we have this goal of an equitable society, driven by more equitable schooling, and a world where we are preparing kids for these complexities and changes, and helping the next generation, escape this idea of simple answers to complex problems, all goes back to the major themes in principles to actions when it pertains to mathematics. And it's one of the things that makes me very, very proud. When I reread parts of this of this document.
Deann Huinker 27:37
I think Steve has kind of set it all. But you know, as I think about this list of effective teaching practices, and I often ask myself the question, well, what makes it effective? The reason they're effective is because they make a difference in the learning of each and every student in that classroom. Every student, which puts equity and access right at the center of these teaching practices and what we envision for classrooms. One
Dan Brahier 28:03
feature of the book that I believe will have a lasting continuing role of guidance is that last section of the book that is on taking action, where we specifically laid out a list of whether you are a policymaker, you're a principal, you're a classroom teacher, here are the things that you ought to be thinking about and doing in your classroom. So while as Steve said, I don't want to think of this all as a checklist, because it is trying to give us the big picture. In the end, we were able to come come up with a suggested list of here's some things that you ought to be thinking about are doing. And that list is just as usable today, 14 years later, as or 10 years later, as it was when we first started working on the document,
Deann Huinker 28:50
we would be remissed. I think if we didn't say from that last chapter on taking action, it really then led to the taking action series, if you're familiar with it. People across the country, the taking action series is that elementary, middle and high school. And it really allows you to dig in much deeper about what those teaching practices mean. And it's filled with examples and vignettes of it happening in classrooms.
Kevin Dykema 29:17
So thank you, Dan, Dan, and Steve, for a great conversation. And thanks for sharing your insights. And more importantly, thank you for being the lead writers on such an important document and entity I'm in for the broader mathematics education field. I know we could talk for hours and hours and hours about this, but you goodness, nice snippets and some good takeaways and good things for us to be reminded of, and to think about how is this impacting that mathematics education for every single student? So I'm gonna turn it over to Luke trend to wrap things up today?
Latrenda Knighten 29:49
Thanks, Kevin. And thanks again to our panelists today. 10 years and going strong. Of course, you can learn more about principal Sachs Chin's by visiting nctm.org/pta And we'd also like to thank our audience for tuning in to our first episode. Be sure to look for new episodes of adding it all up each month. And you can find us on your favorite podcast streaming platform. We'll see you soon. Thanks